Session Information:

How to Identify and Resolve “Points of Failure” in Business Processes

• This workshop will walk participants through a structured approach for identifying, prioritizing, and mitigating “points of failure” in business processes.

• Participants will learn how to identify “weak spots” in business processes that are causing actual process failures, or that may cause a process failure in the future. Workshop will cover techniques to identify and eliminate the root causes of such failures with permanent corrective and preventative actions.

• Finally, the workshop will describe multiple approaches to prioritize solutions that maximize business impact while weighing cost of solutions.

Session Transcript:

Hello, everyone. Welcome back to Intelligent Business Process Management, where Technology meets people and process. So, this session is a special one. We are going to have a true leader of excellence Innovation, has been in this practicing intelligent business process management for many, many years. And it's a true pleasure to welcome. ..., is the Head of Quality Capabilities and Consulting NLP yet, he leads Nokia's Continuous Improvement and Quality Competence Development Programs, as well as external quality consulting, which have deliver over one point one billion euros of business. In fact, he's the author of three books on Lean six Sigma and Quality Management Systems. And he was awarded the sangha bone marrow by the American Society for Quality. Vic.

It's a true honor to have you here and share your expertise with us. Thank you for that.

Thank you, Joe.

Appreciate it.

OK, so welcome, everyone, to the session, and let's get right into the topic of how to identify and fix points of failure in your business processes.

So failure.

It is always success and progress at the Albert Einstein, right.

And this presentation is all about how we can maximize our chances of success and proactively identify points of failure in our business processes.

A little bit about Nokia.

Nokia, the global leader, as many of you know, and in the telecom space, we provide telecom gear to communication service providers as well as enterprise customers globally. And we have about 100,000 employees worldwide and 120 countries.

And the revenues for last year were about twenty three point three billion euros.

We are organized in seven business groups.

six of the business groups are under what is called, Nokia netbooks.

And you can see them there, mobile networks, Fix, IP and optical networks, Nokia Software, Global services, and Nokia enterprise.

And then our innovation focused organization and patterns and future technology research is under Nokia technology.

So what are the failures?

Failure can mean different things to different people, right?

But in the end, we can all agree, it's basically an act of failing in achieving your success, objectives, your, your, your goals, right? And it can take shape, first of all, customer or business requirements not being met.

It can be processed defects that are having negative consequences.

In terms of reworks, BQ, lead time delays, poor quality output, it can be blockage in execution that causes delays, it requires any kind of rework in the process.

Incorrect execution, so, these are all different kinds of failures, one encounters and business process.

And the objective here is when we have a process that either we are in the process of designing or a process that we haven't been using and we've been encountering encountering failures with how can we identify those points of failure and minimize those points OK.

So I want you to take a moment and reflect on, on these questions.

You design robust processes by anticipating crossroad failures.

Do you know how to identify all points of failure in your business problem?

How do you do it? Do you follow a ad hoc or a structured approach to identifying the result from the failure?

And do you know how to prioritize anticipated process failure, drive, appropriate action?

So in this presentation, we're going to cover how to identify all possible points of failure, like I mentioned.

How to assess, what we call, the seriousness of consequence, the body failure, because ultimately, the improvement that you're driving, it has to be determined by the consequence of the failure points of failures in your process.

Learn how to quantify risk of failure, and learn how to prioritize mitigation of process failure risks.

And so, why is that important, to prevent or reduce customer experience defects meet or exceed customer expectations, and to reduce the cost of poor quality from internal and external failures?

So, the technique that we used in Nokia is really an industry best practice for FMEA. And I can share some tips on how we have kind of also enhance this process, failure mode and effect analysis technique as we go through this presentation.

FMEA is a systematic and structured methodology that is used for identifying and mitigating the risks of failure in a province.

It actually originator with what is called FMEA, failure mode and effect Analysis by the US military in the 19 forties.

And it was first used for products and systems which was called design, FMEA, or D, FMEA, that you might know.

And, then, it was expanded to processes, and it's called ....

So, it helps to analyze, improve, and control the risk for process failure, meeting customer needs or expectations, as well as it can be triggered, because business leaders have identified process failures internally in the organization, and theorists across this failure. And, they require, you know, the process, the investigation of these issues, and how to improve the quality of the process.

There are 10 steps in this FMEA process.

We're going to walk through all of these, starting with the forming of the cross functional team, mapping the process, defining, identifying the failure mode, identifying the effect of those failures, determining root causes.

There can be multiple root causes of these failures: Listing the current controls, assigning the severity, occurrence, and detection detection rating, which really is, assessment of the seriousness of consequences.

Start prioritizing for preventive and mitigation action.

Determining and implementing the action.

Calculating the device VN.

Risk priority number, based on those actions, and invalidating the mitigation actions, OK.

So, let's walk through each of these, a 1 by 1, and we will have time for Q&A at the end, as well.

So, how does it work? This is what the template looks like.

Or process FMEA is really very similar to the template you might have seen for failure mode and effect analysis.

The, the thing is that in this case, we are actually walking through the process depth and 1 by 1.

We are identifying each of the steps in the process.

So, we are identifying, defining, first of all, how does the process flow, and then also, how does how can we identify different failure modes at each step in the process?

So let's explain to you how that works, as well as, like I mentioned before, the severity of the failures, the likelihood of a colon, the detection mechanisms you might have right now and, based on all of that, giving it a certain risk priority number and then taking actions to mitigate. And then calculating a revised RPM.

So, these are really, if you look at, think about it, that way, that first is kind of the diagnostic part.

And the second is, really, the improvement part is the situation. You're assessing the situation and then identifying at identifying actions to reduce those risks of failure.

one key point about this is that when you do this kind of the FMEA exercise, you have to Phil lied and then drill deep.

So, what that means is, you have to identify four, at each step in the failure in the process.

What might be different causes for that failure to happen, and I'll get into that.

Individually, drill down the root causes for each of those, OK, so del Y, and rotate.

So now, we go through the 10 steps that I've introduced earlier. We formed the first game. This is, like, in any improvement, you want to have all your stakeholders involved bringing in the your customer, your internal customer, or might be an external customers.

Your process practitioners, those who are providing input to the process, those who are taking output from the process, which is your customer, those who are managing and controlling the process. So all of those stakeholders should not be just already doing it in isolation.

Then, you start off with mapping the process, map out, you can start off, supply it, input process output, customer, kind of map.

And then you drill down and you map out a process.

Which is called the process flowchart a process flow Diagram.

If you really want to understand all of the steps in the process.

one important tip here is that if you keep it at a high level, you will not be able to identify potentially all points of failure in the process.

So just like the concept of waste is very deep in the process and if you just map it at a high level, you will cover all the weights and these kinds of process failures, radiata type of waste as well, right? We know waste is what is called downtime, the eight different types of ways, the tags, overproduction waiting and so on so forth, right? And this is the first one defect.

So, the best way to identify points of failure is to get down into the details, OK? So, make sure that you map the process of the appropriate level.

Then to identify the failure mode, the goal is to identify and capture every possible failure mode. That is broken by the T, We start off with the sidewalk.

And a failure mode is a deviation from the customer expectations and put it down, but it will not affect the success rate of 98, but then, and we are delivering 97%, or even that, these are all failure modes. So why is that happening?

The outcomes are dictated by the polarity of the process, right. So what can we do in the process to improve the process and deliver better outcomes.

So now, some practical tips when it comes to identifying cause of failures.

So, now, envision that, that you have mapped out your process, and you are now starting this exercise of identifying causes or modes.

At each step, in the process, you have to trace how our transaction will load through that process or how you would step through that process.

And ask Debbie, what happens if the input for that step is missing?

Not yet.

What if it was incorrect?

What if it is incomplete?

What if it is too late? What will happen?

So that's for the inputs, but that's not the only thing. That can cause the failure. What will happen if the process step is incorrect?

So, really, what you're doing is, you're asking these questions.

What if, what, if, what, if, any, for possession it out completely? You do not want to stop your team and say, Well, that might not happen. So that that won't list all these failures, and in the prioritization, the ones which are less important or had less serious consequences are going to go down to the bottom.

So how would you do that? Is you work with those stakeholders that I mentioned and you get the people in the room and ask, what can go wrong, trace the process.

Or we say, in the case of physical process, but impossible, you go to again.

So there's only really two ways of walking the process with the practitioners in the room or going to gemba and preserving the process Inaction.

Identify, as you identify different failure modes, or each of the process steps, which is different ways that it can fail.

You have to keep in mind that there might be multiple causes for each failure. You have to assess the impact of each failure mode. What is going to be the impact on the cost of art on the user, out what they perceive.

And consider the sources of the failures. Like I mentioned, there can be multiple multiple sources, there are tools and techniques.

We at all quality professionals we are familiar with, it says the fishbone diagram should cover diagram by wise analysis.

And we want to uncover all of the root causes for the different failure modes.

We want to also identify, and by the way, when we are doing that, we'd also Reading Disability. Then, I'll get to that in a moment. I'll show you how you will also list the current control for each causal each failure mode, identify existing controls.

Which are of two types, either, prevent or detect controls, preventive controls, the proactive ways to prevent the failure mode, and the objective controls detect the likelihood of occurrence.

Or, they detect that the failure rate the only when we when it comes to.

Detection is better, too!

Be able to tell that, are thinking about what happened to protect an imminent failure, as opposed to a failure that has happened. And it does goes on for several days. That means you don't have very good Jen. Or even if you've detected a few hours or minutes that's already detected, you always wanted.

And any signs of energy generating. So, what does that mean?

For each of those failures, you don't have to assess on a scale of 1 to 10.

What is the impact on the user or the customer? And this has to be quantified.

That tends to be something that is shared this a little, but it is, is established and shared with everyone in the workshop, because without A, five on a scale of 10, on a scale of 1 to 10 different things for different people.

But you have to think, Well, what does that mean? Diversity, for example, you might say, is, You know, this is happening. And the user is not able to complete all the tasks that would that widget, or whatever. Or They are able to complete only 60% of their past, something like that. So you got to quantify people can all know. Arm and quickly agree. Yes, Superiority of the table.

Then, as well as the section, that also is the scale of 1 to 10.

Where can always is the most of it, OK, so the most of the failure of the critiques likewise, be the the current is on the table, but pretend.

Highly likely due to the inevitable failure will be there, and then it goes down from there.

And then, finally, for the detection as well.

So the detection is on a scale of 1 to 10. Again, if the detection is very, very poor, then it's going to be a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, OK? And likewise, detective is pretty good. Is going to be lower. Why are we doing this?

Because in the end, we're going to multiply these three and get the risk priority number.

So, the most failures are gonna be severe effects, highly likely to occur and almost a complete inability to detect such a failure, OK.

So, you can look at it, like amendments.

And this is the, again, the sample, that priority number, and this is now a rating, the expense of consequences based on those three parameters.

one of the things that we done at Yale, for instance, is that when you do this kind of an assessment, the question to come up, OK, well, this was a severe risk, but this process is only used in group button.

And so, a score of 600, which is pretty high, right, if you multiply the RPN for this one process which is being used only 1 to 600 on that is not the same as maybe 500 on a process that has been used imported.

OK, So, what you can do, in that particular case, the concept of Enterprise, an enterprise risk priority number where you can multiply such an RPN number or the number of instances of business groups or business units and your company, where the failure is going to be encountered. And, then, you can get a true measure of the extent of damage control.

Advertize the preventive.

And, now, you can quickly with the sending of accuracy here. And then, you get to attack the integrity.

Yeah, the industry norm is that on a scale of one to one thousand.

Because, of course, you can get as 1010 times 10 times 10, on a scale of one to one thousand, generally, 700, or so, is considered a complete redesign of the process or product is required, and of 300 is considered major papers. OK, so, But Canada's major fail and above 700 is so bad, it needs to be completely redesign, and generally below, the low years, that you'd need action for improvements. Now, doing this. Visually, the failure mode, when doing this, because it's kind of, the subject of the team, when data are failure modes that fall below 100, you should not just ignore them, review them. Check to make sure that there are many times of IP or that you're just with the way that will happen.

Us on the critical data and other kinds of failures, which would be perhaps a 200. Or, Is it all in Below? 100. And so you might have to physically pull it up above the Lighting. Can be action.

Yeah.

They. Discuss alternatives or the theme for the most optimal action.

You want to make sure that the device.

You take, identify, and address those clauses to ensure that the actions are honorable and one way that you have the efficacy of these action through the way that users to select.

Typically happens is when you do workshops begin. And then you cannot ask what they are in Each of these actions are taken. So you can say we had a workshop distress bullet under actions with good puppet to power.

To be 100 or 200. Again, goal is to get it. In a moment.

If you don't go on and so forth, and then you will actually go and pilot and then, you know. We just want to see.

OK, that has been piloting just went to law. school and comes actually wants.

Action is innovative and leading quick wins.

Keep it simple.

What exactly? Happened?

You can reduce the need.

The impact of the video, Well, we have this data here and if we reduce the likelihood of occurring, we are seeing the severity because it, if that does happen.

But into, the cost of the customer can be a passenger. However, as part of your improvement actions, you might say, OK, we're gonna install so many airbags. and, and, and, and speakers and so on so forth. So the impact of the customer can be reduced even if the brakes fail, OK? So, that's something to keep in mind and believe it or not, you know, I see the kind of confusion, even with certified Lean, six Sigma about that, the thing that cannot be changed.

Number two, of course, people focus on reducing the likelihood of curling and improving protection. OK, but you've got to focus on all three of them. And the likelihood of occurrence is, how can we minimize the art of this happening? All right. And, and be improving the detection.

one point on that is, your detection, like I said before, is good, if it is let say many days before the failure, you can detect it can happen that it is worse if it is just a few hours before it is it even worth just a few minutes per second before, it's harder a little bit after the fact. So that's kind of how your detection get scored with the words being attacked.

So, like I mentioned, you calculate the device RPN.

And you can see now how the RPN changes from the initial score to a lower score, a forecast, and then you can pilot and and see the true RPN up a comment here about the RPM reduction that I just mentioned a moment ago when you do these kinds of exercises.

That can be, right?

General Management level. This is, first of all, all, the visual that I showed you with the movie or the failure modes, the chart.

Maybe you can say, well, to reduce it further thresholds, so much investment to circle back. fail-over the case of IT. And I've been in these kinds of exercises where we show the chart we showed the reduced this profile. And a highlighter bar which are still very high above that. Hundreds of shoreline and how much investment is needed, that justification to reduce those are OK. So it gives you a business case to aspirin. And management can be subjectively DVD reduction in the risk profile of providing additional resources.

So, then you Pilot, and you will take you to the initial critical analysis to show, is that the more severe than you do a comparison like this. And you can have a gold mine of the one hundred point one hundred RPM, especially borderline, and it's empty bar higher, and justify. what is reduced further, Our, perhaps, it has to be accepted, and there's just contingency because then it's gonna be reduced.

It's beyond your control.

So when you are auditing the, the actionable scenarios in which, you're going to be exercising the process and the, the new process or you are designing or process improvement that, you obeyed and verify the RPN that you're actually achieving is matching what you had forecast, OK.

And always, by the way, we are doing this in descending order.

OK, so, the descending order of the risks, you can have a just by descending order of RPN or like I mentioned before.

If you want to factor in, how much will you see that in the entire corporation, you can have the concept of Enterprise risk priority number, and calculate the true impact to the organization.

Now, what about prioritizing grit? process failure?

one way, you can, you can assess that, is, like, in terms of which one you should act on, right.

So you've done this RP unsporting, you've done this ERP, and you prioritize them, but which ones should be rarely go and act on and what priority sequence. Many times, organizations will just take that RPN sequence, like I mentioned it in descending order or the ERP and the Enterprise RPN.

But also, you have to think about the actions that are most going to reduce your risk. So, that's another way to look at that.

And again, this was something different which is not in the traditional or the end methodology is where you can just discovered quite simply you might say, well, OK, the RPN here was 800 most severe. We can reduce it to 600 or 500 or 200 point drop.

Meanwhile, there's another red which is RPN of 700 or 600 and you can reduce it to 50. So, there's a huge decline in the risk exposure of your organization.

OK, so you have to think about you have to discuss with your team what is it that makes sense.

This concept of looking at reducing the overall risk exposure maximizes the benefit to your organization of mitigating those risks, right.

Likewise, if you just do RPN, is that appropriate, or you should look at the enterprise risk, OK? So, there are different concepts. You can look at the end reduction, you get the absolute value, or you can look at the absolute value of Enterprise that reduction.

Or, you can look at the magnitude of the old minus and go after the one with you there, greatest reduction in risk. So that is all explain how that actually works.

And then, on the accident, it is the cost of implementing those that are the. highest priority. one of the greatest reduction in risk policy, Nice difficulty, rate, control, but it's also controlled. And impact Matrix. Cool. And then you, you take all your risk and you just put all these stickers deal or your pollsters, if you're doing this.

I've got a white Whiteboard exercise, that's how it is generally done. And then you put the posters here. There'll be posters.

and there's other quadrants, full circle in this quadrant.

And, typically, we ignore, OK, you might say that people evaluate this later, or just ignore it, because these are at the higher costs, and the least reduction in risk, especially those that are below 100.

So, this is one where you can use this tool, actually, different ways with the red, to prioritize the goal, Action.

This presentation, my objective was to make sure that, you know, being our deep learning objectives, identify all possible positive behaviors. So, grow to go to the Lord, the process to uncover all possible failure modes.

Assess the status and the consequences. Don't just think of traditional began, but think about the risk to your enterprise as well.

Learned how to quantify the speech. We talked about the doubleclick ad.

and also distributing that group, showed everyone, is aligned on what each of these scores on the Rubric mean. And learn how to prioritize meditation. Or four different ways. You can be an enterprise RPN or the difference between the absolute value initially, and after the forecasted improvement and target them integrate with a reduction of risk coming first.

So, that's my contact information.

And, at this time, I think I'm one minute under my time, it goes to you.

Thank you very much. Thank you for covering.

Thank you for your coverage, the excellent coverage, failure modes and effect analysis, and, I have some questions that have come up during the, during our presentation, and now relate that to you.

Your audio sometimes during the presentation, the video or lotus body and I think has probably something on the bandwidth on your side, but right now, I can still see you OK.

So, I assume that we can carry on as plan. Yes, yeah. If you're a video becomes an issue, I may ask you to turn off your video and then you just stay on audio. But, but, for now, it's good. The first question that came up was related to someone who is in the business sense. And then, he says that we have, we understand seder mode and effect analysis we have applied in our business. But, one of the challenges that we have is that when you start laying out the seder modes and you started out the potential causes for those failure modes and the, and the, and then you mitigate, you start thinking about potential solutions. For the causes.

You, end up with hundreds, Sometimes thousands of lines on an FMEA is asking about what is the kinda. And we understand that, often, the devil is on those details. Like, you mentioned before, that, that's where you need to go.

But he is curious about, if you have, if you have had some practical approaches on how you can, how you can make the process itself a little bit more efficient because it was taking a long time for them to map it all out and come up with. And counter-measures is there and a practitioner like you, the question was, about their efficiencies are or not shortcuts. But the better ways of doing it, that we can get more efficient in the way that we run those FMEA sessions.

Yeah, so I'll say two things. This is a very good question. So I've been in that situation.

Where we were re architecting those in my past life and Motorola where we were re architecting the complete order management system for the company.

And there was really significant risks. There were failures because if there is a failure to your order management system, you will not be able to bulk order, right? So there's a direct revenue. And so what we did was we identified.

Think of. So for example, if you have sales processes the most critical, the absolute, most political processes or football isolated in this case, because by the way I published a study. So I'm happy to share that, e-mail me.

We identified seven critical and we said these are the ones who are going to prioritize funneling approach. And once we identify those seven, because they are the greatest revenue inside the other corporation, then we FMEA size of all the business process. And this is where you can be due to kind of manage your effort. You can see the validity of failure and you can target bonds. Which are both, for example, I know, I mentioned earlier, that there can be multiple causes for each failure.

Might be five different, but, if the stability of that failure is relatively, so, do you want to spend their time two to fish, bone, and all, that, I buy them out of that low figure.

So, so, it's really no point is that you can prioritize the front of the most critical And the second is you can kind of the Pope. Verity we really want to know.

Very good, very good. Someone else, who has a background in the automotive industry, made a comment about them having very detailed design SMEs and then process as MBAs. And then they can be, again, very lancey take a long time, a lot of collaboration and then the, initially, they did this collaborative effort where they'll bring people together. It should do it as a collaborative effort in the same room and then they have evolved to certain software applications that have allowed that collaboration to happen.

On an ongoing basis, curious on your perspective without necessarily you know praising any specific software, how has software have been helpful to you in implementing SME when you have, again, maybe 100 people who are collaborating on a, on a, on a card design. And they have a design FMEA, that then will become a process as MBA and you're constantly redoing design and processed items. So, have you seen like enterprise systems for ... that has been, that has been helpful in your opinion.

I'll be honest.

We don't use any software as a sport, FMEA, but we have done virtual, we do these kind of, you know, that act or go to meeting kind of, autonomy is. All I'm going to do, is, you have to.

Because, like you said, there's a lot of stakeholders involved, you have. The audio zambos, identify the babies born to shoulder, that came from these groups, are typically going to have 50 people. That's kind of how we've done. We've even done root cause analysis because that goes hand in hand with the FMEA in smaller teams. And 10 or 2 levels equal together, but not as a, as a, kind of a cool, if that's what you're alluding to.

Very good. Zack, I'm gonna ask you to turn off your camera because I think there may be a little bit of a bandwidth issue on your side. So, I hope that by doing that, we can hear your audio a little bit a little bit better. So we'll keep going with the audio only. So the, then, the next question has to do with was applications and Nokia itself. We're seeing the company. And the question was, you know, can you talk a little bit about how you're using this process? We're seeing the organization. And that what that experience has been like?

Yup, so a little bit about Nokia. So many, I originally came from Motorola. A lot of the game from multiple Motorola acquisition that Nokia.

And with that, gave them a very strong culture already in continuous improvement and Nokia.

And since we came into this was about in 20 11, at Wired the Business info last year, the total impact from all of this quality and continuous improvement has been one point one billion euros, billion euros and there is now a little bit, a thousand, Lean, six Sigma Berets and Nokia worldwide master, Blackberry, Blackberry, Rainbow, Spleen.

There's a very strong culture of continuous improvement coming specifically to FMEA, this is there like a banker who will, is the leading project, doing both, but in fact, all of it, because the Lean projects are mainly focused on efficiency improvements.

So, there are other Lean tools, like mad and you know, yama, zoom me, kite and studies on this and backup, however, this, and of course, value stream mapping. But, this process of FMEA is extremely popular, so, pretty much any project open, every second project would have an FMEA OK. So, that's the, kind of a short answer.

Over one thousand Bel and easy estimate is probably 40 to 50% of them are using FMEA throughout the operation.

Very good, very good.

Another question that has come up come up is, know, what is, what is the best practical advice you'd give to someone who is, who understands the methodology of an FMEA who understands the mechanics of the FMEA.

But, wants to, to, to introduce it to the organization and do it effectively. The question is about, what, what lessons, maybe, you have learned by doing FMEA ace, that, that, you would share with, with someone who understands the methodologies, but doesn't have, as much as the practical insights, and the collaborative leadership insights on dealing with people when doing the .... What would be some kind of practical tips? you'd give to them on the human side, on the human interaction side, on the planning and execution of SMEs.

Broad question, but this is very important. As the head of the continuous improvement program or not. I'm very proud of the things we're doing this year in this space. Actually. one of the initiatives.

Several initiatives and as I mentioned, at least one of them one of the ones is we have launched the small communication package it in good company that go to all Nokia leaders worldwide every month, one tool at a time.

This is about gaining mindshare.

This is about very short cris, 10 minute read.

They are highly highly praised because leaders, it's not a training module, but it's kind of an awareness module for them to understand. So that is one thing that you can do, is build awareness.

Show leader, the power of what is the tool they've heard about it. Like, this can help you solve your problem, That is one. The other is showcasing success story.

You think that's another thing that we are doing, really amplifying within the internal, kind of the internal Yammer and all of those things, social media channels and the company that we socialize, as well as recognizing OK.

And the fourth thing is it, specifically, in terms of facilitation and all of that.

You should make sure that you have a support system you have shared upon to help your kleinberg climb the mountain, and our ship was our coaches, and mentors will certify. And they are paired with anyone to do anything, for the first time, to coach and mentor them, soft things. I mean, this would be getting into a training session of our, to cover. Those are, like, I mentioned, giving them rubrics and how to quickly get consensus.

There are techniques to do that, because people can disagree on, how do you do that?

So short answer them to the practitioners, which are the certified well, as guides and culture, you know, build awareness with your leadership so that they get, they have buy in and they're sponsoring and asking for more of these.

Very good. Thank you so much for taking the time to share your expertise with us. Really kind of providing a masterclass on, say your modes and effects analysis and really appreciate. Thank you so much for, for thought leadership.

Thank you. Appreciate it.

All right. All right, ladies and gentlemen, this brings us to the closing as they choose, BPM Life. So I'm excited to say that tomorrow we have an incredible lineup of a leader is like ..., Nokia, who are implementing I BPM, using technology, process and people. In the morning early in the morning, the very first session, we're going to have doctor Eli ... directly from Israel, talk about delivering exception operational results by breaking ... for the combination of process peoples and KPIs or measurements. So, and then another. And then we're going to have another global speaker from New Zealand.

And and that will be as I look at the agenda, Rowan ..., who is the founder of Box Fish and Bought. And he's going to talk about transforming into a Lean enterprise to focus on customer value in times of uncertainty. So very topical, a lot of great technological applications, also should be discussed tomorrow. So, you can check out the agenda. You'll receive the link on on this for the full agenda, And we hope to see you back tomorrow. And thank you for joining us today. Have a good rest of your day.